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An Email Trail of
Self-help:
Stopping Abusive Relationships
Contents
Low-Grade Unhappiness Turns To General Loathing
A Spoiled Christmas Brought Clarity
Who is the Real Control Freak?
There are No Adult Victims of Domestic Abuse, Only Volunteers
FROM THE ABUSER’S POINT OF VIEW
Subject: The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans
Subject: What I learned from Evan’s book
Subject: More about feeling guilty when he’s nice
Subject: Good for you for using Evan’s tools!
Subject: We’re doing a Post Nuptial agreement to split our property and income
Compromising Doesn’t Seem to Work
Why Can’t He See How Greedy This Looks?
Subject: Antics with the Post Nuptial are another form of Abuse
He Won’t Leave Even When He Threatens
Subject: Trying to Evaluate the Soap Opera
“Do You Want Money or a Marriage?”
My Husband Accuses Me of What I Accuse Him of
Practicing Evan’s Tactics and Blocking the Abuse
Blocked Abuse Gets Worse Before It Gets Better
Subject: Using money for control
Subject: Irrational Entitlement
Stop
“Discussing and Explaining things to Him
Subject: Yes, you're right and He wants to make me wrong!
Subject: Who buys what? And the Defining moment for leaving.
Learning
That
Everything Isn’t Always Someone’s Fault
I don’t remember when I finally figured out that getting up at 5 AM and fixing his lunch, ignoring his cutting and hurtful remarks, being loving enough, explaining my motives enough, paying half the bills even though his son and his hobbies added considerably more to his share of expenses and walking on eggshells was not going to be enough. I don’t remember when it occurred to me that nothing I did or could do would make my husband, in return, treat me with respect, kindness, and love. I don’t even remember when it occurred to me that having a man constantly angry with me, critical, disappointed, irritated, and unhappy was not a good way to live. After four years of marriage (my third and his fourth), I do remember hearing my mother say the word “abuse” and me shrugging it off. After all, My husband did not hit me. Mom is a mother and mothers exaggerate, don’t they? But, the word “abuse” lodged itself in my brain and took root.
I do remember when the low grade unhappiness and anger escalated to intolerable levels. My husband’s ex wife was leaving the state and taking their son, K, with her. It was a horrible thing to do and the way in which Jan did it only made it worse. “My husband has a really good job and we’re moving at the end of summer, I just wanted to let you know.” Actually, Jan is a woman I like very much but who, in this instance did a really mean thing. She didn’t discuss it with us, offer us opportunities to give input, or offer my H a chance to work out visitation. She was leaving, Her ex could see his son six weeks during summer and at Christmas and that was that. In shades of Dr. Laura, my husband took a moral stand, threatened court action, then took an emotional dive, went nuts, and vented on the nearest target, me! So what had been general unhappiness, criticism, and occasional angry outbursts now became general loathing, constant blame, and rage.
Christmas that year brought some clarity to our marriage. Jan had not yet left with K because of the court order from our attorney. In the end, we settled out of court because K didn’t really want to leave his mother. Jan received everything she had announced she was getting in the first place and we received thousands of dollars of bills. But on the bright side, for the first time we were going to get K on Christmas Eve and have him there for Christmas morning. I was ecstatic because jingle bells, Christmas carols, presents, and spreading love and joy was my favorite time of the year. I filled the stockings, bought gifts, decorated the tree, house, and front yard over my guy’s generally grumpy input. Even though we fought over how much to budget for Christmas, as usual my husband wanted to do what he wanted regardless of our plans and budget, we compromised and spent more than I wanted and less than he wanted to—but both he and his son had a lot of well-thought out gifts under the tree. Me? On the way to pick my step-son up on Christmas Eve, my husband glanced at his watch and commented, “Oh, we have some time. Let’s get you a gift.” I tried to choke back my disappointment. I had hoped that he was hiding a package for me in his closet or something.
My partner wanted to buy me a trinket for my gold choker. It was a nice thought, I told myself. I won’t make a big deal out of it. He wants to get me something and, last minute or not, it’s the thought that counts…blah blah blah. Since I don’t like jewelry unless it is somehow significant, I found a designer phone for my office and that was that. On Christmas morning his son opened all his packages, and my H all of his. I opened the phone my partner had wrapped so his son would see me open a package. Father and son had a ball opening the many little gift-wrapped items in the stockings. Mine hung limp and empty.
When K left for his mom’s, I emotionally left the marriage. Christmas had always been the happiness time of the year for me. Christmas represented fairies, Disneyland, and childhood playgrounds. Christmas became my rainbow after the flood. No matter what happened in my world, carols, wishes of joy, unexpected kindness from strangers, and packages filled with love under our tree was God’s promise to me that my world was OK.
Only this year that promise was broken. I had to face the fact that I didn’t have a real marriage or a reasonable husband. I was saddled with a chronically unhappy man who went into frequent violent rages and now it was very clear that he was beginning to punish me for the many transgressions he assigned to my behavior. I was sick inside.
Playing a “Saint Shelly” character to his “Inner Demon” behavior was not ever going to be a foundation for a good marriage. The first turning point had been the word “abuse” used by my Mom. The second turning point came that January, during one of our many arguments. I had begun fighting back viciously in an attempt to get my points across. No more Saint Shelly for me. During one of our nasty arguments, my H hurled at me, “You’re soooo controlling!” I had to laugh because He was the control freak, not me. He monitored everything I did from how I chose to set the thermostat, when or not I opened and closed the windows, how I drove, when I could dry the clothes, when and how to use the dishwasher—even what brand of soap to use. Usually I didn’t say anything because I often told myself “Choose your battles” and any one of those things was little, wasn’t it? It was just that each little thing added to the next suddenly accumulated into my whole life! So I called my sponsor in AA and was laughingly telling her, “I’m over fifty for God’s sake, how does he think I lived before I married him? Can you believe he had the nerve to say that it was ME who is controlling?”
“Well, you are trying to control him,” she answered.
Boy, did that comment take me up short. “What?”
“You are trying to get him to love you, Shelly,” Mary gently but firmly told me. “You don’t understand what your boundaries are and try to take care of him and do things for him that he should be doing for himself. Why do you pay half his child support? Why do you take care of all the family business, accounting, and car repairs, which take so much time? Because he has a “real” job? Just because you work at home doesn’t mean your time and your job as a writer aren’t valuable. Why have you tried to get him the best lawyer to fight for custody of his son? Why have you tried to find and plan activities for K when that is his father’s job? Because you want your husband’s love and respect and you think you can earn it. It isn’t working, is it? You are trying to control the way he feels about you and how he treats you. So your husband is right. You are trying to control him. This is called co-dependency.”
Christ. All I want is a reasonably happy marriage. First my Mom says that I’m being abused, and then my sponsor says that I’m co-dependent and controlling. What next?
What next was that I had to truly look inside for the answers. My man could no longer be my excuse for living the way I was, allowing myself to be the target of his unhappiness. Whereas he blamed me for our marriage woes, I in turn blamed him. So I joined Co-dependents’ Anonymous on the Internet. It was here that I ran across Dr. Irene’s Verbally Abusive web site. It was here that the veil was lifted from my eyes and I understood what my Mom had meant about abuse and Mary had meant with co-dependency.
My husband was an abuser and I was allowing him to abuse me. WHY? Became the next question. Over the next few weeks, I read everything I could on the Dr. Irene site and any related sites. The magnitude of what abuse is astounded me. How could I have thought that his rage, criticism, and unhappiness was kind of a normal thing and that my loving attitude sprinkled with patience and saintliness would make him come around? The man was mean, unreasonable, and angry angry angry. What had I been thinking? Why was I married to him? Nothing in the marriage was working for me and yet I clung to it, in desperation thinking that somehow, someway I could rest happiness from this relationship.
Over the next year and a half my whole life changed as my spirit transformed. The road was long, painful, and enlightening. I am a recovering alcoholic with over 30 years clean and sober time. I married this man, also a recovering alcoholic, when I turned 50, determined that this was my last marriage and a happy one. We shared the same path, same recovery, same values—what could be better? What could be worse? This was a journey that changed my life as much as sobering up did so many years ago. And it was just as difficult.
I invite you to share the journey with me and gain knowledge from my experience and that of several other women as we learned that there are no victims in domestic abuse, only volunteers. Each of us has come to realize that once we understand that we are not a victim but a target of the abuse, we were empowered! Both men and women can learn how not to be the target of our spouses, partners, parents or children. This email trail will demonstrate what and how we learned to stop the domestic abuse cycle.
A woman, Dawn dropped me an email one day because she had read a desperate post from me on the Internet--on Dr. Irene’s Verbally Abusive website. Dawn thought she could help me figure out my struggles in trying to get along with my unreasonable--very unreasonable husband. The first thing this lovely young woman did was let me know I was not alone in my confusion and quest. She gave me a few sympathetic words then shared a paper she wrote from her ex live-in’s perspective--how he viewed their relationship. Dawn journaled a lot as a form of self-help and this paper was one of her journaling-therapies. “It is very helpful to see it from the abuser’s perspective,” Dawn wrote me--I found it helpful and you might too:
I should avoid emotional closeness, because it leaves me vulnerable and open to hurt. I will adopt an attitude of aloofness and indifference to keep my partner from getting a piece of me. Besides, if I let my partner get into my head, I will be under her rule and will be smothered. I will lose myself. To prevent this, I will subconsciously and consciously distance myself from my partner to keep her from overtaking me, while giving her fleeting moments of tenderness to keep her near me.
Here’s how I’ll go about it.
I will put off her requests for closeness, for talks and for time alone together. I will interrupt her and dismiss her opinions. I will show little interest when she wants to share an insight or a story from her day, and I will not share mine. When she hears me share something with someone else and asks. “Why didn’t you tell me that? I will say.” Or “I didn’t think you’d be interested” or “I forgot.” I will scoff at her interests as well as her choices and habits. Also, I will make sure I don’t miss a chance to point out with a tone of superiority and rightness-- how opposite or different her choices and habits are from mine. This helps prove that any attempts at working on our relationship will likely fail, since we are so different and thereby gives me more reason to distance myself.
I will spend my time at home on house projects, watching TV, reading magazines or playing with the kids anything and everything to leave no time for us to have a private moment. I will stay up each night later than her to avoid any closeness when we go to bed, then tell her she needs too much sleep. If I want to have sex, I will wake her from her sleep and began touching her, knowing she’ll respond because I’ve minimized affection and she’s craving any intimacy I’ll offer. When I am not at home avoiding her, I will pursue activities outside the home and not include her or forget to tell her about my activities until the day of the event, thereby leaving little possibility that she can attend with me.
To keep her within arm’s reach, I will occasionally throw out a “we should do X.” I may even really mean to do something with her, but I won’t ever make it a priority so that other things I have to do will always come first... I will leave my schedule open to attend whatever event I want, work on any project I want, or go out with friends (without considering that I should find a sitter because I know she’ll be home). But I will raise a fuss when she decides to take a night off from the house and the kids without getting my OK. After all, she always checks with me to see if I’ll be home, so if she doesn’t check, she must be punishing me, and I will call her on it. I will evade suggestion from her for a night out together or will commit to a night out grudgingly and without any sign of enthusiasm. When she stops initiating dates for us and then later complains about our lack of fun time, I will (with irritation in my tone) remind
her that she needs to initiate it I can’t always be the one initiating.
If she asks that we have a talk, I will put on my game face of mild irritation at her demand that I share. I
will let her run the talk, not offering much input and not validating her opinions. If she pushes ANY buttons or requests any changes in my behavior, I will unleash my rage and feel it is my entitlement to cut her, criticize, accuse her of riding me and then leave the room or the house, so that she can’t continue talking to me. Her talking is just a cover to get a chance to bitch at me anyway. When she sets up a session with a counselor, I will go so that no one can place blame on me for not going. Then I will tell the counselor that the reasons we have problems is that we are very different people so we can’t communicate with each other.
Once in a while, I will throw her a crumb and share a thought or a hug with her. Or, at the spur of the moment, I will decide -- without asking her first -- to take her out to dinner so that she can’t say to her friends or my family. He NEVER spends time alone with me. I will subvert any attempts from her to talk about us spending more time together during these rare occasions when I do spend a night with her.
I will show disgust at her lack of confidence and insecurities. Then I will bring up her tender spots (insecurities) whenever it helps me gain the upper hand or control in an uncomfortable situation. That way, the focus of whatever comes up is shifted away from me and onto her unreasonable insecurities.
When she reacts to any of this with anger or other high emotions (yelling, getting hysterical, crying, bawling, or walks around joyless and bitter), I will offer very little comfort, concern, reassurance or attention. After all, she is trying to punish me with all her hysterical and depressing emotions, and I don’t need the hassle.
Her anger and emotional reactions provide good reasons to keep distancing myself from such an intentionally hurtful person. I will make sure I tell my friends and family that her only moods are depressed, hysterical, joyless and bitter, and nothing I do is ever enough for her. That way I can make an ironclad case that proves to everyone, including myself, that it is her fault when she leaves me.
Email Trail
Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2001
From: Dawn
To: Shelly
This is Dawn wondering how you are? Haven't heard from you after your last e-mail! Let me know
please. Dawn
Subject: The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans
Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
Hi Dawn! I have learned so much--have a million things to share with you. I am excited and somewhat saddened--but all is not lost at the moment. I was In Colorado Springs doing a conference and found The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans--read two of her books in three days. I now have a solid framework for what is going on. I will write in the next day or two (after I get business out of the way from being away from the office) and share the insights that you, the site, and now this book has made clear. Thank you and I'll write soon. Shelly
Subject: What I learned from Evan’s book
Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
CC: Mom
Hi Dawn, I have a few minutes, so I'd thought I'd share some of what has gone on for me. I went to my conference and picked up a book, The Verbally Abusive Relationship by Patricia Evans and read it and its follow-up in three days. I underlined things on most pages. Although I have been slowly beginning to understand just what has gone on in my life in the last year--this book put it all into a framework that made sense.
Naturally, I think I did what so many women do, which is say to ourselves--"He's not hitting me or womanizing so it isn't that bad." In fact, I didn't even recognize most of this as "abuse" until now. Having a name--"Abusive Relationship" and realizing that it is about "control and superiority" and not about the conflicts in our marriage has created a shift in my consciousness. These are some of the things that struck me like lightening:
1. Abuse is about control over another person and is not acceptable under any terms. All abuse is irrational and unacceptable. It is not something that marriage counseling can address--except to end it.
2. Verbal abuse is just as damaging as physical but more insidious because it isn't recognized by most people, most especially the "victim."
3. Abuse is not a conflict or "problem" in marriage that needs to be worked out in therapy--it is a violation and needs to be stopped.
4. In healthy relationships, a person doesn't have to constantly defend themselves, feel unsafe, be belittled, ignored, discounted, and try desperately to "explain" their behavior and thoughts so the other person will "understand" and not keep lashing out at them.
5. That breaking things up in the house (explosive anger) is only one form of abuse intended to control--that ignoring, discounting, threats of divorce and abandonment, threats to take income, name-calling, countering, withdrawal, accusing and blaming, and other things are also abusive and need not be tolerated (for some strange reason I thought I should be able to handle the non-rage stuff and haven't recognized it for what it is)
6. Explaining my actions and motives (defending myself) and understanding his position do not work to stop
abuse--which is a violation of me.
7. If he won't change, I may have to end the relationship.
8. Because abusers operate in a different reality (one of power-over) and I operate from one of mutuality (nourishment and understanding)—I can never explain anything to his satisfaction and all our "misunderstandings" will never have closure because I can't explain and/or understand what happened, therefore I will often bring up the past (in an attempt to understand and find closure)
9. There is a difference between conflicts and violations. Conflicts can be settled by mature and caring adults--and can be taken to marriage counseling. Violations have to be stopped and have little to do with the receiver of the abuse.
10. I have a right to a nurturing and SAFE environment.
11. I must trust what my feelings tell me and not his version of my reality.
12. He is a person and his behavior is a choice. He is not "compelled" to abuse me.
Well, how's that? I feel great. I am free from the crazy making because I know what's happening now! I also went to a therapist while in Colorado (Robert McBride, the author of Change is the Third Path)--and he explained more about what I read. I am taking the position of "No more abuse" and following all the suggestions in the book. Evans wrote that you will know in a matter of several months if your abuser is the kind who may want to change and there is a chance for the marriage.
Dawn, the only problem now is that he is being wonderful! The man I fell in love with. He is expressing
concern for me, giving me messages when some one calls, being sweet and concerned with the dogs, listening to me when I ask for help --etc... I know it’s part of the cycle, but it makes me feel weird to have him being the man I want--I want to forget the past and move into the idyllic marriage. In other words, I feel guilty for exploring the verbally abusive relationship and for even writing this email to you. I feel guilty for preparing to stop the abuse and I even feel guilty for calling it abuse!!! I feel icky when he kisses me and I don't want to have sex--although I did. (he didn't pressure me—I played along, afraid not to!)
That's one side of me. The other side knows I've found the key. Sometimes his nice side is in place for a month or two--
Dawn, thanks for being here. Any feedback will be appreciated. Thanks.
Subject: More about feeling guilty when he’s nice
Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
I think I got it--this is why it’s so wonderful right now! From Dr. Irene's page "The angry person pursues when you have pulled back emotionally or are fed up with them." & "When the angry person is bad, they are very, very bad. When they are good, they are very, very good. (They have to be - to make up for all their mis-behavior!)”
Subject: Good for you for using Evan’s tools!
Date: Wed, 15 Aug 2001
From: Dawn
To: Shelly
Shelly, It sounds like you are doing GREAT! That book is such a revelation (the Evans book). Yes, all of that stuff is abuse. Your list was a clear summary and, in my opinion, if you have internalized all that, you are doing VERY well. I'm glad to hear hubby is being perfect now. Keep hopeful but be watchful for a shift and be prepared to keep up your boundary, practice the "stop it's" and detachment when need be. Don't get back to a place where you need him too much or where you rely on him too much. Maybe you can get to that place in a year or two if he really has changed. It's not outside the realm of possibility. I think what Dr. Irene says is you have to have radar on for the rest of your life probably for infringements of your boundaries and abuse signs (covert and overt.) This may be burdensome at first but after a while, it just becomes part of your nature and if your relationship transforms into a healthier give and take, balance of support, than that is WONDERFUL! I wish that for you. I hope your husband wants that too and wants to take a look inside to battle his own demons. That's what it takes, in my opinion.
Love to you, Keep me updated, Dawn
Subject: We’re doing a Post Nuptial agreement to split our property and income
Date: Thu, 16 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
Hi, It means so very much to me that I have you, who have gone before me into the shadowy realms of domestic abuse. Why do you understand so much? It seems you have a finger on the pulse of my experiences! My radar is on and working. He still outwardly is being wonderful but went to his attorney to look over a post marital agreement. After numerous battles over him spending whose money and not sticking to agreed upon budgets, him accusing me of controlling our finances (i.e., I won’t “let” him spend his hard earned paycheck), he decided we had to split our finances and pay our bills 50-50. We went back and forth on this for a few months until he decided to divorce me, then I put my foot down and insisted we go through with it whether he divorced me or not.
My husband returned from the attorney saying he wants a clause in our post nuptial that if one of us has an affair then it nullifies the agreement. He's already asked for three major changes in our agreement, going over every detail and turning this into a nightmare. I keep agreeing with his changes trying to make him happy (old co-dependent me). This time I set another boundary. NO. No more nit picky changes. His money is his and mine is mine. You see, I came into the marriage with considerably more than him and during the marriage he spent considerably more than me. I spent my investment money on our house and other rental units and made it “ours.” So now my investment money isn’t earning anything and my income is less than his, but we have no bills. He can’t see my contribution of no car payment and no house payment as a significant contribution and in fact, accuses me of living off his income. So it has to be separated!
I have been “compromising” on this agreement since he wanted to get one. My attorney, God bless her, suggested splitting our property NOW and see what we have left in the marriage. Lee Majors, attorney, could see I’m not ready to walk yet. Bob agreed with her. So I offered several suggestions for splitting our property in a fair manner and he didn’t like any of them. He insisted that he wanted to be cashed out, if we split up. Then he began to pick the agreement apart and ask for changes that always seem to give him additional access and entitlement to my funds.
1. He didn’t want it to be split now but only in the event that we divorce, I reluctantly agreed because I bought
his objection that dividing property would drive us farther apart (even though the week before he wanted it NOW)
2. He didn’t want to “sign away the rights” to my income ad infinitum so he asked for a two year agreement to
be renegotiated at that time. Again I reluctantly agreed--why does he keep going after my income?
3. He didn’t feel our agreement should be enforced in the case of death (I’ve left our stuff to him). I agreed again to keep the peace but what is this? If an agreement is fair today--which it is, then it’s fair if I die. He says he’s putting my grand kids into his will now (something he refused to do when we did our wills) so I won’t object. One of our fights was that I have left all Bob’s property to his son in my will but Bob won’t do the same for my grandkids. He takes all my property and leaves it to his son. I don’t trust him. If I die, he’ll just write them out, something he knows my values would never let me do to his son.
I have to face once again that he has boiled it down to money. Mine. How can he receive more that what is his? I find it so hard to believe that he keeps doing this. I'm not rich! He has spent a whole year to 18 months telling me how much he makes and that he wants control over his money and I was cheap (my budgets) he made so much overtime and blah blah blah--now he has control over his own earnings and he’s desperately trying to get mind. I don’t understand. I find it hard to believe he can’t know how greedy he sounds and how abusive it is to try to get a clause in the agreement that would nullify it on a whim. I am taking a stand. The answer is NO! No more abuse, no more compromising—His changes always lean in his favor so he gets more money that he’s not morally entitled to.
Dawn, your take? My stand is "no more." Just want to make sure I'm not over reacting. Especially since he's being so "nice." Thank you lady, once again for walking me through this. Are you still single? How old? What profession are you in? Where do you live--I'm a bit curious.
Shelly
Subject: Antics with the Post Nuptial are another form of Abuse
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001
From: Dawn
To: Shelly
Shelly, I'm so sorry but my "take", to put it bluntly, is these antics with the agreement are just a different form of the same old abuse, and his true love is your money. I'd like to pinch his head off! (I know temper, temper.)
The thing about the affair clause is that, that is the one form of overt abuse or wrongdoing in a marriage that is more tangible. What I mean is, if someone has an affair, it can't always be proven beyond any doubt but it comes off as being believed and so WRONG. Yet when it comes to abuse of alcohol and drugs that is a matter of opinion and personal taste. Or emotional abuse or angry outbursts. You can SAY you are being emotionally abused or he's an alcoholic and it's destroying the marriage, but it's tough to convince the majority that that's all true. But a hint of an affair, then you are chastised and everyone is on his side. I guess if he physically abused you, then you would have the same experience. If you could show the bruises, broken nose, whatever, then he would be chastised for being an abuser, but not for alcohol abuse or emotional abuse. I'm being a touch extreme here but I think you get what I'm saying.
So, my opinion, ABSOLUTELY NOT will you put in the agreement that if you have an affair the agreement is null. You are in your rights and sane mind to reject this ridiculous clause.
I know it doesn't seem like it but if you reject it and no more discussion, he still won't leave. He may stop being nice for a little while, but he'll be back. He's not getting out of this relationship but he wants you to think he will at any moment over anything, like if you reject the clause. You keep giving in a little more, a little more in the name of keeping peace, and now he wants more and more and more and more unreasonable clauses. It's just like with kids. IF you don't say 'No" when they are 2 years old and give in to "keep the peace" now, you are creating a monster child for later. Your husband is a monster child and you have had a hand in creating it by giving in on things you KNOW IN YOUR SOUL are ridiculous and unreasonable but are given to "keep the peace."
I apologize for being so harsh and blunt. I'm so mad that this man is treating you this way.
I know it's hard to believe but this man WANTS your boundaries, just like a kid wants discipline. He will not leave you over this and if he begins to change from nice to nasty, detach even more, and watch how he runs back to being nice and "forgetting" about that clause he's so hot on asking for now.
Stay strong, lady. Hold your ground. You feel like saying OK on the clause because you know you won't cheat and you feel if you say no that shows that you are thinking of cheating, but that is co-dependency, Shelly, talking. How dare he question your integrity? How dare he put your marriage on the line for a ridiculous clause. Your behavior over years of marriage is his "guarantee" that you won't cheat. This man is starting to look like a narcissist that may not be able to be helped. I'm sorry to say it but that's how it's looking. You will know that when you know though and when you are ready to know and no sooner. But in the meantime, do not agree to that clause and drop it and go about your business.
You stay strong! You have no right to punish him back over this (like getting too over-reactive and angry or trying to relentlessly getting him to "see" your point) but you have no obligation to give this BS any of your energy either. Just say NO and detach on this issue but enjoy the other good stuff he's giving you. When he brings up the clause or the agreement, just repeat, “I said no to the clause and I've stated why. If you can't accept that I can repeat my stance again but I will not be drawn into a conversation where you are trying to "convince" me I am wrong for saying no and I'm am probably going to cheat. My answer is still no and I will listen to what you want to say but my answer will still be no, whether you accept it or not.” Repeat this as needed.
I'm 31 and single. I have a 2-year-old son. I work as a Technical Writer for a large bank in Minnesota. My educational background is in Journalism and I worked out of college as an editor for various newspapers. I'm from a small town in northern Minnesota.
Let me know how it's going! I get my drama vicariously now! Dawn
Subject: Trying to Evaluate the Soap Opera
Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
Dear Dawn, You are my daughter's age! I can't believe you young ones are so wise. How did you find out everything about this at such a young age? You astound me. A two year old! Wow. Lots of energy but you're young enough to handle it. And a writer, like me! I majored in Alcoholism but my English department kept trying to get me to change my major to journalism or English. Do you do free lance stuff? I cherish all this stuff you send. Now I understand better on why you wrote the thing from your husband's perspective--you're a writer. Pretty hard for us not to write, isn't it?
I am writing everything down in my journal--I am seeing it all like a soap opera now. My Mom agrees with you (I forward everything to her) and basically both of you see the same thing and give me the same advice! Then I ask myself, "am I presenting all this in such a manner as to make my husband look worse than he is? Am I encouraging all this?" I know that is part of the co-dependent pattern to take on the blame and feel I can make it better therefore I must be the one making it worse! So I just try to stick to the facts.
It's worse with my H. At first he seemed so much better. I journal about it and so will from time to time just slip in my journaling rather than rewrite what’s going on. The journal entries are long so I'll try to edit out my self-pitying lamentations.
8/16 Morning.
Well, things are moving along. I have no way to evaluate if they are good or bad. Bob is very upset that I point out he is focusing on money and asked, “Do you want money or a marriage?” he does not understand why I ask him this, acts very confused. I told him NO on the infidelity clause and he spoke up saying he wanted to prove to me he was not after money. He wants to sign over the West Point properties (these are rentals I bought before I met him and put his name on them because we were combining our incomes). Bob claims he is not going to ask for money--but I want to pay him 50% of principle accrued since I put his name on it.
My marriage partner did a whole song and dance about how he wanted to prove his good intentions. I asked him several times if he were sure he wanted to give my rental business back (it was totally mine, he helped with repairs once we met) He kept pressuring me to call my attorney and have her draw up the deeds to sign back to me. That afternoon he came home and told me he didn’t really want to sign over the houses but just wanted to see my reaction. “Now I see what kind of person you really are,” he accusatorially told me. I told him he was abusing me and I left the house. I came back and wrote my attorney that he didn’t really intend to sign the houses over. He was “testing” me. My husband later told me I had misunderstood him, that although he did not really want to sign the houses back to me, he still intended to do it. “You hear only what you want to hear.,” he hurled at me. I felt like a fool.
Email from my H to me
The events of the last few weeks have made many things very clear to me. You accused me of being in this for
the money then, you left a note on the counter, which accused me of being self-centered and out for the money, yet, that’s exactly what I see as your motives. You accuse me so I will back off so you can get your way. The West point houses are a perfect example of this. I see this as being a manipulation so you can get me out the rentals for your own personal financial gain. We have worked hard on these houses with me doing many of the repairs (heat, plumbing, yard, painting, clean-up etc) with the understanding that this was" our investment". Now that they are in good shape I guess I am no longer needed. I do not want and will not take any compensation for this, since money is not the issue here. I will sign them over to you but I can no longer trust you and will not enter into any financial or rental arrangements with you again. Your husband
I told him he made some good points and then tried to explain things to him again. “When I was the one doing without and struggling-juggling to accommodate your desires, I set my plans aside. I am no longer going to deprive myself because you want things and listen to you try to say I stopped you from spending your money (which I didn't, your feelings came from your own guilty conscience). “I keep feeling like I have to explain everything--but he never gets it.
I told him “I need to revert back to the way I did things before I met you for my own protection and peace of mind. I also cannot live with your abusive anger, your threats of divorce when you don't get your way, your constant attempts to gain control over me, and you playing 'tricks" on me to see my reaction." Then I told him it’s the last time I will explain any of this. I owed it to him to say it once, but I won't explain or justify myself any longer.
He relied:
Thank you for spending so much time and effort in analyzing my stuff. Some of what you say is true but I think you have been trying so hard to villainize me in the last few days that you have even had to make things up, such as trying to turn my attorneys advice about the adultery clause into some kind of way to escape our agreement, I sure never thought of that. Then last night you heard what you wanted to hear and would not even let me finish a sentence before screaming I was being abusive. This most recent falling out we have had is not because of any dry-drunk of mine. Granted I have been the match that lit the fire in the past but not this one. I will not accept responsibility for all our problems in the last year, I did react badly to your controlling and manipulations and have said and done many things I truly regret. We have discussed, argued and talked a lot on this. It sounds like you are still nurturing resentment over what happened 6 months ago. I have tried my best in the last few weeks to be a good husband so if it's not good enough for you, I need to know now. I would like to move on and leave the past behind (but not completely forget). I am very content with the current money arrangement, I have my money you have yours, I think you are not though. My suggestions have gone no-where.
Being a good Alanon you took almost your whole letter telling me all about my problems so I have taken some of mine to do same. We could both probably benefit by trying to focus more on ourselves and not what the other is doing. About the WP houses. When we talked about selling them you know I wanted to hold them until the bridge was built so we could turn a nice profit. Wanting me out now is selfish and self-centered of you but I know you can justify it by saying you are taking your attorneys advice and taking care of your-self. If I did the same to you I sure I would hear what a terrible person I was. Any-way the money is not important so you do what-ever you want. I can assure you I will be taking care of my-self also. I am very hurt over this, if you even care. I not sure what’s in our future, some-times I feel hopeless for the marriage. So many things have happened to drive us apart. You recently would talk about how we worked so well together when we had a project like the houses to do, but I can't see that ever happening again. I need to know honestly where you stand. Right now I think you want me out. If not I'm hanging in and hoping we can put what ever is left together and make a life.
I wrote back that it was abusive to say I was screaming--I wasn’t.
Later that day we had this little scene and I did the Patricia Evans thing and it worked! Afternoon: I made lunch and My H ate in stony silence. After lunch he asked in a mocking tone, “So what are we going to do about taxes? You are going to take all the deductions, I guess? And I get nothing?” I said his tone of voice was abusive and I wouldn’t respond to abusive questions. Then I remained silent. “Well, I just want to know. Don’t I have a right to ask a simple question? Oh now I can’t even ask questions and you call it abusive, is that it? Huh?” After I walked away, I waited a few minutes. Then I came up to him and said, “Anytime you want to discuss something and can speak to me respectfully, I’ll be glad to talk.” Then he sarcastically said, “Yes, Madam. OK Mam” and he saluted me. I repeated, “Your mocking tone is abusive and this conversation is over.” In a few minutes he came in and talked to me nicely about the taxes and I explained how they would work under the agreement and read the clause to him.
8-21-2001
Letter from my H is waiting on counter. It essentially says that now that he's thought about it, he realizes that it is me that has the money problem, not him. This is evidenced by the fact that when I put his name on my houses, I
asked him to sign a document saying that my original investment would be credited back to me if we broke up. I ignored his accusation.
8-22-2001
Bob came home from work and wanted to talk at midnight. Asked very nicely how I could afford a new truck,
to pay down some money on the WP homes, and fix up my Rambler. I told him I hadn’t done anything yet, so what
was he asking? Bob said he thought about it and the figures did not add up. I told him my finances were my
business and not to worry about them. My husband then said he could not sign any agreement until we had full
disclosure of all my resources. “For Christ's sake Bob, you think I'm hiding something? What if I were? Sooo? It’s not yours anyway. Here we go again with you thinking something's being withheld from you. The Coxes I loaned money to paid off the house for $30,000 that I have to reinvest, I had $10,000 in royalties in December, I got an advance from Pocket Books—what else do you want to know?” He apologized and told me he had forgotten about the pay off of the Cox’s home. We bantered words-- him justifying his accusations and denying he really said what he said. “Yeah, you didn’t say I was hiding money from you like you didn't accuse me of possible infidelity?” Bob claimed he never said that. I replied it was a thinly veiled insinuation. He said it was in my head. I went to bed and told him I didn’t want to hear about finances anymore.
8-23-2001
Note on the counter saying he prayed before he talked with me that he could say the right things so I could
help him put away his fears. “We should be able to talk,” he wrote. He is opening his finances to me and laid out
his check book and statements. He ended by saying the last thing he wanted to do was have another fight.
So Dawn, here I am. AGAIN he focuses on money--that I'm hiding it. Christ! I am beginning to hate him. Just hate him. Even if I was hiding money--I would be hiding mine, not his! So why would he care? Dawn, I am just now beginning to want out! How's all this for vicarious drama?
Subject: Using money for control
Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn and Mom
Dear Dawn and Mom, What do I do? It's like a brick wall. Bob wrote this to me after coming home and accusing me of hiding assets from him and saying that he wouldn’t sign anything without “full disclosure” because it seemed to him I had to be hiding something.
I thought we could talk openly, I never thought my question would lead to such a huge fight. I had hoped you could answer and I could it to rest. I'm sorry it turned in to such a mess. Love, your husband
I answered:
How the heck do you think I'm going to respond to yet another sorted accusation? I'm hiding money from you? And you start the fight at midnight--just as I'm going to sleep! What is the matter with you? I have always been very open with you and you have access to all our financial stuff, in addition to which we file joint taxes. Now where the heck do you think I would hide money--get a fake SS and file a second tax return? I'm sick of you focusing on what you think you're not getting of my money. I'm sick of you making overt and covert accusations and then wondering why I don't take it well. Would you just start looking at yourself and ask yourself why you keep obsessing on what money I may or may not have? You wanted to split our finances and have singular control over your money--not be partners and plan financially together--you have it, now let it rest.
His response--the brick wall of blame:
Remember your response of "you’re not going to discuss your finances to me" prompted my accusation. It would have never come out had we been able to talk, but you’re right it would be difficult to hide from me. I'm sorry it came out that way. Wish we could talk again. This last split of our finances was mandated by you so you could relinquish control and work on yourself. It is not right to again blame me.
Subject: Irrational Entitlement
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001
From: Dawn
To: Shelly
Shelly, It seems from reading everything that it would be hard for me to judge each financial-related fight/discussion without knowing the exact history and amounts and assets, but I think the bottom line is that it seems you still engage him with the financial talk. You want so desperately to get him to see your point (I know how you feel.) and the one time out of 20 that he sees your point, you think, "Oh, maybe he can be sympathetic to my perspective." But he just goes back to some selfish, irrational thing.
If it's possible, just plug along dividing out everything fairly, exactly half and what you had before the marriage stays or you honor whatever you feel is fair to honor (AND NO MORE!) and you stop reacting to his rare rational moments over the finances as well as his frequent irrational moments. The notes on the counter, don't acknowledge. the thinly-veiled threats of "you are making money the issue, not me" coupled with a turnaround of something he previously didn't care about. What you are doing, from what I read, is dividing up the money/assets and making it clearly defined what is what, whose is what and what happens if your marriage doesn't make it. If your marriage improves then your agreement may go bye-bye, but you need to feel security on your own right now and define your marriage w/o money being a factor. He takes care of him. You take care of you. Period. No more engaging in discussion about it, no return notes, no return e-mails about money or the agreement arguing the details or "explaining your point."
Of course, you must talk about it to get it settled but you state what you want and if he gets mad or threatens or feels unfairly treated or tells you that you are the one who cares so much about the money, just say "hmmm, OK, Bob. Now again, this is how I want to work this asset out, does this work for you?" Just slowly work toward a legal signing of this agreement, even if it takes three more months. Have patience and drop discussions and just move as far as you can and then have your lawyer contact him on anything he is stuck on, or have your lawyer contact his lawyer, if he has one. I suspect he will be worn down by your matter-of-fact attitude about it and will either show his anger in a way that will make you decide to get out or he will go along with the fair agreement and realize you’re serious and he will not make you feel bad or guilty for taking care of yourself.
I know this is hard. I know it's not as easy as I wrote above, b/c of emotion and ups and downs and other factors in the relationship. Just hold your ground on the financial and keep communication open on all other subjects.
I truly think you are still giving him too much entry into your mind/head for discussions on financial and you are wanting so badly to make him "understand" but it's futile, Shelly, it's pointless to make him "understand" or even see that 4/2=2. He may think 4/2=1 and he's getting the short end, but that's what lawyers and accountants are for, to figure out the most equal and fair financial agreement and than go ahead with it.
I experienced this irrational entitlement on a much smaller financial scale with my ex. He thought he was getting screwed when I left but conveniently devalued me paying all the remaining medical bills for the birth of our son, me paying for the washer/dryer, ceiling fan and blinds that I left at his home and me providing the large majority of the baby items (crib, diapers, bottles, breast pump, bouncy seat, swing) when our son was born, and these things add
up, not to mention that I was the one who took Family Leave after the baby was born for partial pay and for about 4 weeks of non-pay. He thought he was getting screwed b/c I rescinded my former promise that he would get the child deduction on taxes for 2000. I said I was taking it now to compensate for all of the above as well as the equity I paid into his home that I would never benefit from.
Of course, even after I spelled it all out to him, I was still talked about to my face and his parents as a promise breaker and liar and I was screwing him over, but he wasn't gonna fight me b/c it wasn't worth it.
Pure irrationality. Yes, I hated breaking a promise. But that agreement went null when we broke up and I had to take care of my interests because he sure as hell wasn't taking care of my interests. He slid by whenever he could and I never held him to his promises b/c I LOVED him! Sound familiar? Hang on, lady, and let me know what's going on! Dawn
Subject: Yes, you're right and He wants to make me wrong!
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
Yes, Dawn, I know you are right. I allow him to accuse and I defend (or explain) and I give his stuff credence. At the moment he's stuck on me "deceiving" him because I asked him to get a household credit card in his name for us--that I didn't want to do it in my name (which is what we're using now). He ordered a card, but when I wouldn't sing the papers to be responsible for it and asked that he do it and put me on as a user (as he is on all my cards) he went ballistic and is certain I somehow deceived him. I was trying to figure out how I had deceived him--and my
mother said that his accusation didn't mean anything except that he wants to make me wrong and as long as I tried to make sense and explain it to him, I would make myself crazy. You both are right and so I pull back again knowing that he won't ever understand. I've just about had it. I am ignoring most things from him. I am getting strong at being able to hold my ground. He eventually does settle down and talk reasonably to me when I won't accept the abusive stuff.
It's interesting about your ex. Doesn't it just break your heart that instead of wanting to see to the welfare of you and your son, he makes you the enemy and strives to get more? I miss the fact that Bob doesn't want to watch out for me. He wants to make me look bad and get what he's "entitled" to. How sad, for him and me. Does your ex pay child support? Does he feel entitled to "rights" with your son that are abusive? How do you handle it?
I just want Bob to go away. What was the defining moment when you knew you would leave? In Virginia I have no reason to leave--he hasn't hit me and verbal abuse is not a reason to divorce. I have to trust that my Higher Power has my best interests in mind.
Thanks again for the insights. It's like our men are so much alike--they don't want to be screwed--fair isn't fair, there is always more that they feel they must be entitled to! And they always feel we must have done some devious thing with impure motives to "get" them. Because basically that is what they are doing to us. Later, Shelly
Subject: Who buys what? And the Defining moment for leaving.
Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2001
From: Shelly
To: Dawn
Shelly, It's so tough to begin the division of partnership, like dividing finances, financial responsibilities. It's one aspect of a real marriage, a real partnership, and breaking it up is like the start of the end. I'm speculating that's how you may be feeling. Your request to have HIM get a card and sign you on as a user is only fair and rational. Yet he cannot give you what you have given freely. May I suggest something on this specific thing? Tell him that you rethought it and you don't want your name on his card as a user. Leave him on yours if you feel it would be punishing to take him off, but if he is recklessly spending on your liable cards, then take him off those cards and just calmly inform him of that. I know this seems like a ploy b/c you flip-flopped on your name on his card and then he will see it as a tit-for-tat thing, but I am suggesting this to just clearly divide out your liabilities and finances, from joint to separate.
I don't know what you use the cards for -- like just routine stuff, like paper towels and cleaning supplies and home fix-it stuff or whatnot, and I don't know if you've been more apt to buy those things on your card (I would guess yes) but now is when you buy things for the household that you use or partially use (T.P., toiletries, shampoo, groceries, etc.) and don't complain about you buying it and him using it, but you don't buy the things that you don't need
or use. Like if he's buying some garage tools or whatever that you don't use but he uses your card to buy them. Or he decides to buy some groceries and you could wait another few days on groceries, have him buy them on HIS card. Let him be responsible for sustaining himself on HIS liable card. This is the point of taking him off your liable cards. Not to punish but to go with the goal of "you take care of you, he takes care of him." Does any of this sound plausible?
My ex and I split the child care/custody 50.50 so no child support is exchanged. He is a good Daddy. He was always committed to our baby, just not me. I never was jealous of his treatment of our son, but I often thought if he could treat me or classify me the same as he did his son (like always happy to see him, thinking about his needs), our relationship would have been a lot less troubled.
The defining moment for me was about a month and a half after I had moved out of the bedroom (I did that after finding out an ongoing lie of omission he had promised to be forthright on but I found that he was still omitting and it was one of the only somewhat OVERT abuse signs I could get my hands on so I ran with it, but really I was fed up with a range of things but all so veiled and covert that they didn't seem plausible enough to convince the outside world that I should throw a fit and move out of the bedroom. At that time I still gave a damn what the rest of the world (really his family and friends) thought of me.)
Anyway, about a month and a half in, I went out for dinner with my brother (18 months younger and just about the same age as my ex). I related to him an incident with the ex that had happened the past weekend. During the incident/argument, my ex had said that the only reason he began dating me again (we had had an on-again/off again thing) was because he was drunk. (he was drunk the first night we got back together.) But the venom and hurtful way he said it/meant it, just made me recoil, but almost immediately, I started making excuses for him saying it and starting finding reasons to blow it off. When I told my brother about it, he just looked at me incuriously and said, "Look, I would have to BE drunk to be able to say that to my girlfriend or ANY girl." It was that moment when it hit me -- that my ex just couldn't be kind to me, just didn't value me, even as much as he might a stranger, that the disdain he felt for me could not be explained away or attached to any stress or circumstance in our relationship.
That moment was my epiphany and from there on out, I began to get my brain focused on me first, my child second and my ex as a possible third. I took care of me and neither expected or relied on the ex for ANYTHING -- emotionally, physically, help-wise, kind-wise. Three weeks later I had formally decided to move out and the next night I told him. Five weeks later I moved out. Of course in between many details were argued and fights were had, but I knew I had to leave for my soul. But the defining moment, the change of mind for me, was that conversation with my brother and my realization of how little value I was giving to myself to "buy" into the almost zero value that my ex assigned to me.
Does that make sense? Take care and keep me updated, Dawn
Tue 28th, Dawn also sent me these words of comfort--did she write them?
A time comes in your life when you finally get it, when in the midst of all your fears and insanity, you stop dead in your tracks and somewhere the voice inside your head cries out?. ENOUGH! Enough fighting and crying and
blaming and struggling to hold on.
Then, like a child quieting down after a tantrum, you blink back your tears and begin to look at the world through new eyes. This is your awakening.
You realize it's time to stop hoping and waiting for something to change, or for happiness, safety and security to magically appear over the next horizon. You learn to ask for what you want and if you don't get it, to discern if it is best to change the request, drop the request or ask it of a different person, and in the process, not begrudge the one who couldn't meet it.
You realize that in the real world there aren't always fairytale endings, and that any guarantee of "happily ever after" must begin with you? and in the process a sense of peace and calm is born of acceptance.
You awaken to the fact that you are not perfect and that not everyone will always love, appreciate or approve of who or what you are? and that's OK. They are entitled to their own views and you learn the importance of loving
and championing yourself? and in the process a sense of new found confidence is born of self-approval.
You stop complaining and blaming other people for the things they did to you-or didn't do to you- and learn that the only thing you can really count on is the unexpected.
You learn that people don't always say what they mean or mean what they say, and that not everyone will always be there for you, and that everything isn't always about you.
So, you learn to stand on your own and to take care of yourself. And in the process a sense of safety and security is born of self-reliance. You stop judging and pointing fingers and you begin to accept people as they are and
to overlook their shortcomings and human frailties? and in the process sense of peace and contentment is born of forgiveness.
You learn to open up to new worlds and different points of view. You begin reassessing and redefining who you are and what you really stand for.
You learn the difference between wanting and needing and you begin to discard the doctrines and values you've overgrown, or should never have bought into to begin with.
You learn that there is power and glory in creating and contributing and you stop maneuvering through life as a "consumer" looking for your next fix.
You learn that principles such as honesty and integrity are not the outdated ideals of a bygone era, but the mortar that holds together the foundation upon which you must build a life.
You learn that you don't know everything, that it's not your job to save the world and that you can't teach a pig to sing or get blood from a rock, no matter what you do.
You learn that the only cross to bear is one you choose to carry and that martyrs get burned at the stake.
Then you learn about LOVE. You learn to look at relationships as they really are and not as you would have them be.
You learn that alone does not mean lonely. You stop trying to control people, situations and outcomes. You learn to distinguish between guilt and responsibility and the importance of setting boundaries and learning to say NO.
You also stop working hard at putting your feelings aside, smoothing things over and ignoring your needs. You learn that your body really is a temple. You begin to care for it and treat it with respect. You begin to eat a balanced diet, drink more water, and take more time to exercise.
You learn that being tired fuels doubts, fear, and uncertainty and so you take more time to rest. And, just as food fuels the body, laughter fuels our soul. So you take more time to laugh and to play. You learn that, for most part, you get in life what you believe you deserve, and that much of life truly is self-fulfilling prophecy.
You learn that anything worth achieving is worth working for and that wishing for something to happen is different than working towards making it happen.
More importantly, you learn that in order to achieve success you need direction, discipline and perseverance. You also learn that no one can do it all alone, and that it's OK to risk asking for help.
You learn the only thing you must truly fear is fear itself. You learn to step right into and through your fears because you know that whatever happens you can handle it and to give in to fear is to give away the right to live life on your own terms.
You learn that life isn't always fair, you don't always get what you think you deserve and that sometimes, bad things happen to unsuspecting, good people? and you learn not to always take it personally. You learn that nobody's pushing you and everything isn't always somebody's fault. It's just life happening. You learn to admit when you are wrong and to build bridges instead of walls.
You learn that negative feelings such as anger, envy and resentment must be understood and redirected or they will suffocate the life out of you and poison the universe that surrounds you. You learn to be thankful and to take care of many of the simple things we take for granted, things that millions of people upon the earth can only dream about.
Then you begin to take responsibility for yourself, by yourself, and make yourself a promise to never betray yourself and to never, ever settle for less than your heart's desire. You make it a point to keep smiling, to keep trusting, and to stay open to every wonderful possibility. Finally with courage in your heart, you take a stand, you take a deep breath, and you begin to design the life you want to live, as best as you can.
Go to Section Two: My thinking changes as I don't allow abuse